Naido in Andy's Vision  

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(@nostar)
RR Diner Patron

One of the more puzzling pieces of the Return for me is Naido/Diane. 

I just noticed that the Fireman's visual communication to Andy in Part 14, which is pretty straightforward in its own way, shows Naido twice. Once between Laura and her angels and Cooper splitting into Mr. C, and the second time between Lucy in the hallway and the three images of the #6 power line pole. Nothing else is shown twice like that.

Is it significant? The idea that Naido was just a shell for good old Diane seems too easy and obvious, especially when combined with Diane and Cooper's out of nowhere romantic relationship. Does her two appearances in the vision (and especially where she appeared) hint that there's more to Naido than meets the eye?

Apologies in advance for this possibly pointless post.

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Posted : 20/06/2018 2:52 pm
(@brian_hardin_ii)
RR Diner Patron

I'll say that it's not a pointless post.

Naido/Diane, I still don't get.  I just fail to see the connection that they are the same (I mean, yes obviously they are, one morphs into the other on screen) but I mean prior to that there is literally ZERO connection.

The character of Diane here just seems totally off from how she was presented in TP and FWWM.  Given we don't have anything at all to go on as she wasn't actually anywhere for us to reference.

I think it just makes no sense that cooper and her magically fall in love.  THIS is my one and only complaint in the entire show.  When cooper went into the red room it was specifically to rescue Annie because he was in love with her.  I just don't get it.

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Posted : 20/06/2018 3:58 pm
(@carnifex)
RR Diner Patron

I quite agree,    there is more to this than meets the eye,   but I don't believe we ever have enough information to determine exactly what the connection is between the two of them.  It isn't a pointless thought at all.

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Posted : 20/06/2018 4:25 pm
(@chris_flackett)
Roadhouse Regular

Yeah, Justice For Annie! Seriously, I'm with you on this. If it's a retcon, it's a very awkward one. If it's the result of a change in the timelines, fine, but they've not made enough of a point of it in the plot. 

The thing that annoys me about Naido, obliqueness aside, is that for someone who suddenly is meant to be so important, is that she is not seen or even referred to after Part 3 until Part 14. And then, what is it that she actually does that is so important? She senses Mr C but doesn't do anything to help defeat BoB. What is the significance of change to Diane?

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Posted : 20/06/2018 4:36 pm
(@brian_hardin_ii)
RR Diner Patron

Tho.. the one thing that does make this make sense:

I read somewhere that we see the American Girl (played by the same actress that portrayed Ronette) in the same "room" that we first saw Naido in.  American Girl can see, whereas Naido is blind.  Both were "attacked" by Bob.  The difference is, Ronette was able to see Bob's real face.. that's why American Girl can see. Diane, on the other hand, did not see Bob.. that's why Naido is blind.

The issue I have with that is.. woof, that's a pretty big jump to make for that to make sense, even for david lynch.

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Posted : 20/06/2018 5:42 pm
(@julie_loader)
Deputy
Posted by: Brian Hardin II

Tho.. the one thing that does make this make sense:

I read somewhere that we see the American Girl (played by the same actress that portrayed Ronette) in the same "room" that we first saw Naido in.  American Girl can see, whereas Naido is blind.  Both were "attacked" by Bob.  The difference is, Ronette was able to see Bob's real face.. that's why American Girl can see. Diane, on the other hand, did not see Bob.. that's why Naido is blind.

The issue I have with that is.. woof, that's a pretty big jump to make for that to make sense, even for david lynch.

Yeah I tead that one on facebook yesterday. 

And why is  she naked on earth?

Coop wasn't! 

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Posted : 20/06/2018 6:17 pm
(@carnifex)
RR Diner Patron

Yeah I wouldn't exactly call it reaching,   but considering how briefly she's actually in the series,  it's hard to believe her role is that pivotal.      Because assuming all that is true,   that role turns out to be rather important.

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Posted : 20/06/2018 7:52 pm
(@b-randy)
Chief Moderator

Maybe it's a whole other Cooper from a whole other timeline.

I dunno  ? 

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Posted : 20/06/2018 8:00 pm
(@julie_loader)
Deputy
Posted by: Brandy Fisher

Maybe it's a whole other Cooper from a whole other timeline.

I dunno  ? 

Yeah, could be.

Coop didn't recognize Naido as Diane till the heads changed.

  Did he look like he remembered Naido from the mauve room? 

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Posted : 20/06/2018 9:39 pm
(@carnifex)
RR Diner Patron

He looked quite curious to me,    but I didn't see any recognition.

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Posted : 20/06/2018 10:33 pm
(@dobbshead)
Roadhouse Regular

I could see Naido being of paramount importance because in fact she is Diane 'in a cage' and Diane is necessary as one half of the Magik ritual that brings about Judy/Richard/Lida/Valero-verse. 

As for being in love, I might hesitate to assume that.  Yeah it was a passionate kiss, but not inconceivable for long, close friends that love each other very much, though not in love, to celebrate the end of a harrowing experience with a sincere kiss.  They weren't all lovey dovey otherwise, not really anyway.  A kiss of relief I might be able to accept.  And then the sex, well that was just necessary and very, very far from 'in love' coitus. 

I had always taken it to be that someone (Judy or Bob or the Arm or whoever) tried to hide Diane behind three walls.  First they put her up in the mauve tower, then they took away her eyes and voice (So neither she nor Coop could identify each other), then they replaced her with a look-a-like back in the world.  Diane must have been very  important for all that. 

Why it had to be Diane though, I don't know.  Because of the rape/she saw Bob?  Because she loved Coop?  Because she was hip to the Blue Rose?  Why her and not Annie?     

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Posted : 21/06/2018 12:16 am
(@chris_flackett)
Roadhouse Regular

At the risk of playing devil's advocate, was it a sex magick ritual though? Yes, things change after and the whole Parsons ritual is detailed in TSH, but at no point in the show is the idea of such a ritual discussed at all or planned. I sometimes think there's a whole missing part in between Laura disappearing and Coop appearing back in the red room in Part 18. Even by Lynch standards it feels like we're being asked to make massive leaps in terms of connections.

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Posted : 21/06/2018 3:00 am
(@micah_sam)
Lodger

Gonna echo everyone else here and say this is absolutely NOT a pointless post. The Diane/Naido stuff is extremely, extremely odd. One thing is the transition from Naido to Diane, where we go into the Red Room and her face sort of "hatches" out of one of those egg things. . . I can't wrap my head around what this means, exactly, but it's a particularly unusual effect. 

The other thing that seems utterly strange (to me) is their kiss, and her comment about "Cooper, the one and only." The rest of the series seems to suggest, there is NOT only one Coop. 

The whole scene in the sheriff's office feels like Cooper's "idealized" conclusion to a dream. Candy is there with sandwiches, he's reunited with old friends, Bob is defeated in spectacular superhero takedown fashion, he shares a passionate (almost too passionate) kiss with someone he probably had a loving (but maybe not "in love with" relationship). 

It all just seems too . . . convenient.  

 

 

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Posted : 21/06/2018 9:39 am
(@b-randy)
Chief Moderator
Posted by: Joseph McMurty

I could see Naido being of paramount importance because in fact she is Diane 'in a cage' and Diane is necessary as one half of the Magik ritual that brings about Judy/Richard/Lida/Valero-verse. 

As for being in love, I might hesitate to assume that.  Yeah it was a passionate kiss, but not inconceivable for long, close friends that love each other very much, though not in love, to celebrate the end of a harrowing experience with a sincere kiss.  They weren't all lovey dovey otherwise, not really anyway.  A kiss of relief I might be able to accept.  And then the sex, well that was just necessary and very, very far from 'in love' coitus. 

 

I gotta meet your friends! ? 

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Posted : 21/06/2018 12:00 pm
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