I see throwing theories around us just a bit of fun to bide the time until the next episode is aired. The thing I've always loved with Lynchs work is the feel of it. I don't watch horror films because I just don't like them but I really enjoy the unease I feel from his work which sticks with you for days or weeks after watching.
I get that but it's getting a bit too factional and intense now, too many dogmatic statements and short tempers. What was a fun experience, a shared common interest is beginning to splinter and become factional, to use the word again.
A lot of the fun has gone. Not from the show, from here.
I see where your coming from. I think the over analysing is getting a bit out of hand and some people can't take a bit of messing around but I've just learned to filter them out as much as possible and just do what I've been doing since I posted the first time (which by the way I got jumped on for daring to say incest instead of sexual abuse about FWWM). See? Wasn't all sunshine and roses at the beginning either ???
I like reading other people's theories - and quite frankly if anyone's going to get sneery, I just tune them out.
I see this forum as kind of stream-of-consciousness. It's handy to be reminded of bits you may have forgotten or not connected. It'll be interesting to see which bits have 'answers' and which remain fish-in-the-percolator moments. So the fact people might say 'I wonder if there's any connection between...' does NOT mean they're desperate for answers or 'things being tied up neatly'. And if you respond with a snarky 'explanation of Lynch' you may very well find it being glossed over.
We're here for a bit of a blether about Twin Peaks - kindly hosted by Pieter. If anyone finds that annoying, and wants people to pay attention to their definitive statements - maybe you want the other place through the red curtain??
I see throwing theories around us just a bit of fun to bide the time until the next episode is aired. The thing I've always loved with Lynchs work is the feel of it. I don't watch horror films because I just don't like them but I really enjoy the unease I feel from his work which sticks with you for days or weeks after watching.
I get that but it's getting a bit too factional and intense now, too many dogmatic statements and short tempers. What was a fun experience, a shared common interest is beginning to splinter and become factional, to use the word again.
A lot of the fun has gone. Not from the show, from here.
I think that, as we get closer to the end, all the various things we showed up for, the mystery, the answers, the "cozy feeling" the music, Dale, Audrey, ourselves as we were 25 years ago- the fact that this is a ride that is not going to entirely (or at all) give us what we are looking for lends to the risk of that disturbance in the force of this space. There is still snarky, kind fun here, and I would be sad to see you leave. There is a level of theorizing and discord Icam not interested in, and will avoid those threads. This is a place both strange and wonderful, good detective. Let us proceed pure of heart, and find our way to the white lodge.
Not saying that I plan to leave the place, and even if I did, I certainly wouldn't post about it.
Comes to a point with the show where I'm not interested in making any predictions, don't really care about being right or wrong. Even the approaching end of the show isn't bothering me, since I can always watch it over and over. Nah, it's more that some seem to have taken it to be their personal quest to push their view as gospel and that gets right up me nose.
I have total respect and gratitude for Pieter, and will be forever thankful that he's provided this place and opened it up for the likes of us. Not only that, but he runs a tight ship in a fair and even handed way.
Maybe it's just me.
As I said before I'm doing my best to filter out most of the nonsense and pettiness and try to enjoy the site for what it's always been. And yes, Pieter deserve his place in the white lodge for putting up with us all.
The only thing that has been annoying me is the multiple duplicate topics. It's not that hard to check what's been posted before dag nabbit.
I don't have a problem with duplicate posts as it's quite intriguing that different posts on a similar topic can go completely different directions - depending who contributes, or what they've read in the intervening time. But I suppose if you were short on time/ internet connection it would get frustrating.
We could summarize this as saying: "I"m hoping most things remain a mystery".
Or on a more meta level, we could summarize this as saying: "I worship Lynch so much (which is in no short supply on this Forum), I will accept almost any ending to Twin Peaks."
Please note, I am not singling anyone out. (I'm looking at you, Bad Fan!)
[Dons fireproof suit.] 😉
Hi Bad Fan,
Ha, I'm not trying to have a flame war, Ric! [You can hang up your suit again, lol]
That said, I have to admit I don't care for indictments of my affection for David Lynch that call into question my "critical faculties" (c.f. Yambag's rebukes of my posts elsewhere).
Anyone who reads more than one of your posts would know that you don't lack for "critical faculties." You are a very articulate and very thoughtful Forum contributor.
I appreciate what you said in the original post here about not needing (or as Mr. C would say not wanting) a resolution to the mysteries of the show. In fact, anyone remotely familiar familiar with Lynch's oeuvre really shouldn't expect very much in the way of clarification.
I would just argue that precisely because of his reputation Lynch can get away with dangling plot threads much more than almost anyone other showrunner ever could.
Here, I will once again mention LOST. Back in the newsgroup days, there was a superb group (alt.tv.lost) that was very similar to this one. People loved the show, loved the references to literature, did tons of research into tiny barely-perceptible clues, and endlessly discussed how all the answers to the numerous mysteries would be resolved.
When many of those questions were left unanswered, and since Damon Lindelof and Carlton Cuse didn't have the cache Lynch does, many, many fans went absolutely ballistic. And I'm not talking about casual fans, either. In fact, it seemed that the more effort one put in to understanding the show, the more people vehemently resented the ending.
That will not happen here.
But the fact that it won't leads to an interesting question: How do we judge how good Twin Peaks: the Return is?
For the Lynch lover, the question is already answered - it's great! Just another in a long line of Lynchian masterpieces! Who cares that we never found out who Judy is, who cares what happened to Josie, who cares why Dougie turned into a little gold ball? It's Lynch, man!
Don't get me wrong. I was as atomic-bombed by Part 8 as much as any other Fireman or Senorita Dido. I just hope Lynch doesn't lean on his reputation for eccentricity as an excuse for being lazy about answering what I consider to be integral questions about the show.
Others have persuaded me that it's totally reasonable for forum partcipants/Twin Peaks fans to use the forum to lament the show not being how they'd hoped or to sleuth/crack the case... or, for that matter, to assign local/discrete/concrete meanings to every potential signifier/network of potential signifiers. For my part, I tend to get a little too prescriptive or doctrinaire, something KDawg and others have rightly taken issue with.
But I do hope that some viewers have the experience Lynch provided me-- an epiphany that made me appreciate how rewarding film and television can be when artist/audience slacken the restraints of the implied contract of genre/convention/legibility etc.
I don't wish to suggest Lynch (or The Return) should be immune to evaluation, but I do think that a sensible approach to an abstract, non-literal, or surreal artwork is a measure of deference toward the mystery of the artist's intentions.
That's not how many forum participants seem to see The Return-- which is totally fine-- I merely wish to invite like-minded viewers to caucus around what doesn't need resolution or rational explanation -- that is, to redirect attention toward either themes, topics, etc. or what other types of television, film, art, scholarship, etc. lend insight into how we might understand The Return.
Fair enough.
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Nice to see your incisive wit transform into a thoughtful critique, Ric. No need for a warning before this post ?
I'm just not feeling it any more. The theory side of things, that is. Seriously, I'm totally sick to death of 'em.
I enjoy each episode for what it is and trying somehow to fit it into what's gone before, but as to where it's going, I have no idea. Not a single one and, as I said in other threads, I'm happy with that. I have never in my entire life watched a show where I had no idea what's coming next. Most books I work out long before halfway through, so I then have to rely on the skill of the writer to make it interesting enough to keep turning the pages.
Frost and Lynch have gone the next step, IMO. Created something totally unpredictable but watchable at the same time. Yes, it's disjointed, yes it's frustrating but to me that's half the fun.
I'll be extremely disappointed if we get a Lost or St Elsewhere ending, or even a 80s Dallas "It was all a dream" cop out but otherwise, I'm happy with things so far and theories be buggered.
You will not be extremely disappointed. David Lynch will not slap on a tired cliche because he's so lazy and unimaginative.
As I said before I'm doing my best to filter out most of the nonsense and pettiness and try to enjoy the site for what it's always been. And yes, Pieter deserve his place in the white lodge for putting up with us all.
The only thing that has been annoying me is the multiple duplicate topics. It's not that hard to check what's been posted before dag nabbit.
Hi Sammy,
I agree with what you say above except for this one tiny nit to pick: In my opinion, it is hard to check what's been posted before. 😉
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Hi Caoimhín,
Thank you so much for the kind words. Mutual admiration - it's a wonderful thing. 😉
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I like TPTR because it exercises the intuitive nature of my mind--for a while it wasn't pulling me in and then it began to draw me back in like a tide. If it didn't compel me enough I would not watch it. There are so many shows and movies that are well-written, acted, directed (in some ways much more efficiently that this) that don't compel me to watch. Like The Americans, for example--it seems like a wonderful program but I'm not compelled to binge it. If you are, don't hate me and I may watch it eventually and get hooked. It doesn't have the wonderful disruptive quality of this show. (Mr. Robot does and I can't wait for the next installment of that. It also has some of the potential weaknesses of TPTR because of its disruptive narrative style, mainly the red herring factor.)
Hi cyndee,
Dittos on Mr. Robot. The end of the first season was one of the best WTF moments in the history of television. =:-O
😉
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Fire walk with