Here's one for the quantum physics fans among us. Reading an article today that was linked from 'the search for the zone' website (finally got around to reading these properly), I came across the following quote:
"In pursuing this endeavor, Everett boldly tackled the notorious measurement problem in quantum mechanics, which had bedeviled physicists since the 1920s. In a nutshell, the problem arises from a contradiction between how elementary particles (such as electrons and photons) interact at the microscopic, quantum level of reality and what happens when the particles are measured from the macroscopic, classical level. In the quantum world, an elementary particle, or a collection of such particles, can exist in a superposition of two or more possible states of being. An electron, for example, can be in a superposition of different locations, velocities and orientations of its spin. Yet anytime scientists measure one of these properties with precision, they see a definite result—just one of the elements of the superposition, not a combination of them. Nor do we ever see macroscopic objects in superpositions."
My question is this: could you make a quantum argument then for Coop observing Carrie Page hearing Sarah Palmer call Laura's name a superposition in physical terms?
The full article is here for anyone that way inclined:
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/hugh-everett-biography/
One could certainly make that argument, however...
However, the ONLY way one could pull that argument off would be to support it with evidence from previous episodes or seasons. Once that's done, then it really removes the quantum argument from Coop and makes it more about the entirety of the show itself.
I really want to engage in this conversation, but frankly......a little outside of my wheelhouse. ?
I think so, but only in a conceptual type way. Schrodinger's Laura is dead yet she lives. The interesting thing to ask might be who would be the observer that makes it one way or the other. Perhaps this would be another way to inflect "who is the dreamer?"
With this approach, though, I definitely tend in the direction of saying it is us. It is the interpretation of the viewer that gives a determinate result. This would mean that we are not separate from the work, but implicated in it, which I think is cool.
With this approach, though, I definitely tend in the direction of saying it is us. It is the interpretation of the viewer that gives a determinate result. This would mean that we are not separate from the work, but implicated in it, which I think is cool.
This I can get behind.
I really want to engage in this conversation, but frankly......a little outside of my wheelhouse. ?
Don't worry, I only understand it in basic laymans terms. I tend to get the gist but not the nuance. I just get excited by the ideas. I think there's something wonderous to it all.
I really want to engage in this conversation, but frankly......a little outside of my wheelhouse. ?
Don't worry, I only understand it in basic laymans terms. I tend to get the gist but not the nuance. I just get excited by the ideas. I think there's something wonderous to it all.
Definitely wondrous.
And gotta say I'm glad to hear I'm not the only who didn't understand it from a deep and implicit angle. Was starting to wonder if I'd wandered into the TP Mensa chapter. ?
....hmmm, I wonder who in TP might belong that? Suppose Leo is the president?
My question is this: could you make a quantum argument then for Coop observing Carrie Page hearing Sarah Palmer call Laura's name a superposition in physical terms?
Well what characteristic exactly is collapsing from a superposition to a specific? Her identity as Laura? Or the timeline? Or the death of... maybe Judy?
I am dead, and yet I live does sound Schrodingery...that's interesting. Of course he didn't really go killing cats.
If I'm honest, I wasn't trying to apply it as a literal interpretation of The Return but I think there's something interesting there as a metaphor for what happens in the show. It was particularly this part that caught my attention:
"In the quantum world, an elementary particle, or a collection of such particles, can exist in a superposition of two or more possible states of being. An electron, for example, can be in a superposition of different locations, velocities and orientations of its spin. Yet anytime scientists measure one of these properties with precision, they see a definite result—just one of the elements of the superposition, not a combination of them."
See, Laura exists in more than one state. She is missing and she is Carrie Page (and although likely, it's not altogether stated that the one has led to the other). And she is in different locations; Odessa, The Red Room, Twin Peaks. And all these Laura's are one and yet are seperate. A superposition. Carrie hears Sarah call Laura from a different time. She screams like Laura. But she is not Laura. Here perhaps is the combination of the superposition as referred to scientifically in the quote.
And yet Coop/Richard, as observer, as measurer, can only see Laura Palmer. He is narrow in his vision, he can only see an element of the superposition, Laura as a victim. He can't see Carrie Page, or disbelieves it, and he can't see the bigger picture And all it leads him to is confusion: what year is this?
As I say, I'm not trying to apply strict rigorous physics to the show, but having fun exploring thr ideas. I obtained the above from the search for the zone website and I do think they've chosen the content for a reason, even if its not meant to be taken too seriously. I mean, this would be info that would in some way inform Hastings path to finding Briggs? Possibly, anyway, from a character point of view.
Schrodingery ? ? ? ? ?
I'm going to try to use that in everyday language. Thank you.
If I'm honest, I wasn't trying to apply it as a literal interpretation of The Return but I think there's something interesting there as a metaphor for what happens in the show. It was particularly this part that caught my attention:
"In the quantum world, an elementary particle, or a collection of such particles, can exist in a superposition of two or more possible states of being. An electron, for example, can be in a superposition of different locations, velocities and orientations of its spin. Yet anytime scientists measure one of these properties with precision, they see a definite result—just one of the elements of the superposition, not a combination of them."
See, Laura exists in more than one state. She is missing and she is Carrie Page (and although likely, it's not altogether stated that the one has led to the other). And she is in different locations; Odessa, The Red Room, Twin Peaks. And all these Laura's are one and yet are seperate. A superposition. Carrie hears Sarah call Laura from a different time. She screams like Laura. But she is not Laura. Here perhaps is the combination of the superposition as referred to scientifically in the quote.
And yet Coop/Richard, as observer, as measurer, can only see Laura Palmer. He is narrow in his vision, he can only see an element of the superposition, Laura as a victim. He can't see Carrie Page, or disbelieves it, and he can't see the bigger picture And all it leads him to is confusion: what year is this?
As I say, I'm not trying to apply strict rigorous physics to the show, but having fun exploring thr ideas. I obtained the above from the search for the zone website and I do think they've chosen the content for a reason, even if its not meant to be taken too seriously. I mean, this would be info that would in some way inform Hastings path to finding Briggs? Possibly, anyway, from a character point of view.
Thanks, that's really interesting!
Fire walk with