The inspect that went into the 1945 girls mouth was hatched from an egg that looked like it came from the experiment, but was maybe not bob as his egg was larger and black. If it was Laura palmer, then maybe it was some other force unleashed during the dimension-bending experiment which gave her, or whoever it is, some kind of power, as she seemed less effected by the woods men's radio broadcast.
In her dream saying not to wear it, the point was that she'd die.
Mike's chosen mission is to STOP Bob. He throws the ring in to help Laura. Laura chose to be killed rather than allow Bob to use her body the way he had used Leland's.
The scene also makes it look like Laura was created to fight Bob. Which is new development as Laura never seemed so "powerful" in the show.
Exactly what I thought.
If Laura was fabricated by a mystical entity to be an opposing force to fight evil...
...she sure struggled with her duties.
She won in the end though...I guess that's all the matters.
Wait, Zack. I always thought she lost. ?
Because she died.
There's a theory that Bob was actually trying to possess her, but because she put on the ring, he couldn't and had to kill her, but I don't think Lynch has ever confirmed this theory.
But still, she died, and Bob kept roaming the world the following 25 years.
Well...BOB wanted to be her and never got the chance...she resisted him and used death as a means of escape.
Its a shitty way to win but at the end of FWWM you can see her joy from the fact she's finally free.
Right, she sees the angel at the end while accompanied by Cooper who seems pleased that he has led Laura back to the angel, as if he is seeking the golden orb laura.....but I always read this in tension with the other scenes in the disjointed red room which directly go against this: for instance, Laura has cooper on the chair, where she always kisses him and whispers to him, she then makes the same gesture she made to 'buck the truck driver' at the canada party which is the 'fire that will never be put out' the snapping of the fingers(a sign of controlling a male). Laura then says, see you again in 25 years, meanwhile.......... then she unleashes her terror, evilness, indicating she has affirmed evil eternally.....shortly later cooper embraces evil in order to save annie and this evil cooper is let out while the good remains.
So how to read the two together, here is what ive come up with: the good cooper wants to show laura the angel-law, the dream of the american sweetheart, etc.; laura uses coopers affection as a way to control him, violate his law, and thus get garmanbozia-golden surplus enjoyment from the violation to enact a reign of terror......the good cooper keeps trying to keep his dream of the golden atom laura alive over and over, showing her the angel, laura is encouraged, the cycle repeats forever, well 25 years.....(time and time again BOB BOB BOB, etc.) The good laura, if there is one that was not killed by the 'fire' is barely able to sustain itself, for now, before she is overwhelmed by sadomasochistic impulse to revenge on cooper and the law which created a community torturing her for golden surplus, like woodsmen seeking the golden atom promise of Laura....
A tension similar to the one between cooper and laura in the red room can also be seen in the giant and his fancy woman friend: the giant is paralyzed/silenced by the appearance of the atomic blast and bob, violation of law-reality, splitting the atom, etc. violates law, suspends the giant, he is caught in an exception to his law, and the exception to his law he dreams up is the girl elevated above the rest, dealt with in a passionate different manner than others( this is not 'lawful', a place of exceptional desire, love, etc. in the old frame of law, laura, like the song desribes before being shut off by the woodmen). The giant dreams of a golden atom-laura as still existing that he tries to rehabilitate(much like cooper showing the angel and only becoming stuck for 25 years); the giants fancy woman companion then steps in to take center stage of dealing with the law, which is now feminine law of enjoyment which makes affection from the exception to the law spilling out of the giants head the law to chase. This compliments the woodsmen who have suspended the law, since it is a desire that leeches off of a paralyzed giant/cooper, who also suspend the law for their own ends; while it also provides the dream and cover for the ordinary people who have been rendered unconscious by the woodsmen, but are nonetheless in their trance, which is why all of them, inclusive of James(gotta be prom queen, take enjoyment, ignore really accepting her problems) tear Laura limb from limb, even if they pretend to be good-white; the woodsmen are the effective law, leeching off the giant, James imagined laura orb does not exist and the problem is systematically suppressed so the surplus profit-enjoyment can flow, the problems-mystery is not fought for or even recognized as long as they have another golden orb(becky, a students, etc.)
I dont think Laura escapes in death, the same unsolved problems just keep repeating themselves over and over again in the red room with no intervention to break the loop, which would have to come from the finite world. Lauras mystery and problems/debts were never solved, and what destroyed her has proliferated more in the last 25 years, the only way to lay her to rest(maybe even as the good laura) would be to bring law and justice to the situation in the finite world, which dougie-cooper/giant are now tasked with, in a different mode, without the golden laura orb and without the closed ring of enjoyment, facing the harsh reality of their failure and lack of knowledge, etc.......
I wish Lynch had put Nadine's face on that shiny orb.
It would double the number of haters! ?
How about what the Experiment model spit was all the evil and the face of Bob is a metaphor of all evil and then the Giant????? does the some thing with the golden stuff and the sphere with Laura's face as just a metaphor of good?
I mean it doesnt need to be Bob or Laura just a clue for us to know how it started, because we can relate Bob as bad and Laura as good.
Given the information about creation of Laura as BOB's visavis and the whole history of her being molested by BOB, i can now see the refference to LORE - Jesus vs Lucifer. Both resisted to temptation(according to biblical mythology). It was quite interesting to receive some answers but there are also many questions. For example:
What is BOB in fact? Was he a human(Robertson - son of Robert), or a spirit from the very beginning?
Boy and Girl - Leland and Sarah(to far from being true, as Leland originated from TP, and those ones were Latin american), or Richard and Linda?
Maybe if we connect the two questions we'll receive an answer. BOB was sent to Earth, but as fetus(or something simmilar) with lumberkacks to guide him, and he needed to be born by human woman?
As of Laura i'm not sure as she was born in 1971, while we can see her fetus(or smth) in 1956.
Lumberjack killer - Jurgen Prochnov in FWWM?
Mother- Experiment - Big Bad? Threating to balance in Universe? If so, then she is even more dangerous than BOB himself, as she was his creator.
And also, P.S. isn't it strange that in the series we can actually see that FBI agents are aware of spirits existence? Blue Rose. Maybe they know smth. about this Experiment? Hint - picture in Cole's office.
I'm gonna stop writting as my head is going blow. It will be interesting to watch further episodes. I guess the truth is out there=))
Agreed girl not Sarah. Agreed the boy looks Latin American. Thanks for telling the fact where Leland originated from. I don't think it's Richard. He was born after Coop came out of the Lodge. What makes you say Richard and Linda?
Hmm, interesting. Laura orb certainly was born by human woman, but she became a human. Bob, we never knew really lived as a human. Could he be the spirit of a person who was once alive? In another thread I was asking around for a seas2 plot thread that went nowhere, about Leland saying he knew Bob as a neighbor at his grampa's house where he used to stay in the summer. I had always assumed that meant the neighbor was the previous host of Bob. But then the name of the neighbor was Robertson.
Why the hell did Lynch abandoned this plot thread? It is so important and it's creepy good!
P.S. Oh the FBI in the show is a wacky bunch, they say Twin Peaks inhabitants are nuts, FBI is nuttier! Screaming Cole, trans Denise, acerbic Albert, now Tammy's butt shake, Diane, Cooper.
About Richard and Linda i mean maybe Giant was not tellling about Richard Horne, but about other Richard and Linda(boy and girl from 1956). Maybe Giant wanted Coop to know about the past. If Robertson is, or was just a host, then why BOB would put the letters under the nails of his vctims? T - for Teresa, R - for Laura, B - for Ronette, and O for Maddy? R,O,B,T - Robertson, or shortly BOB. Leland was also just a host, why not put the letters from his name? Thats why i think, or thought that BOB was a real human.
FBI agents are strange and charming in many ways. But i do want to know about Phillip Jefrries(Dawid Bowie was great at this role), and i'm interesting why this character is still alive? Why not Chester Desmond? He also dissapeared under the strange circumstances. Who is Judy?))) Why the monkey says her name after Lauras death?
Given the information about creation of Laura as BOB's visavis and the whole history of her being molested by BOB, i can now see the refference to LORE - Jesus vs Lucifer. Both resisted to temptation(according to biblical mythology). It was quite interesting to receive some answers but there are also many questions. For example:
What is BOB in fact? Was he a human(Robertson - son of Robert), or a spirit from the very beginning?
Boy and Girl - Leland and Sarah(to far from being true, as Leland originated from TP, and those ones were Latin american), or Richard and Linda?
Maybe if we connect the two questions we'll receive an answer. BOB was sent to Earth, but as fetus(or something simmilar) with lumberkacks to guide him, and he needed to be born by human woman?
As of Laura i'm not sure as she was born in 1971, while we can see her fetus(or smth) in 1956.
Lumberjack killer - Jurgen Prochnov in FWWM?
Mother- Experiment - Big Bad? Threating to balance in Universe? If so, then she is even more dangerous than BOB himself, as she was his creator.
And also, P.S. isn't it strange that in the series we can actually see that FBI agents are aware of spirits existence? Blue Rose. Maybe they know smth. about this Experiment? Hint - picture in Cole's office.
I'm gonna stop writting as my head is going blow. It will be interesting to watch further episodes. I guess the truth is out there=))
Agreed girl not Sarah. Agreed the boy looks Latin American. Thanks for telling the fact where Leland originated from. I don't think it's Richard. He was born after Coop came out of the Lodge. What makes you say Richard and Linda?
Hmm, interesting. Laura orb certainly was born by human woman, but she became a human. Bob, we never knew really lived as a human. Could he be the spirit of a person who was once alive? In another thread I was asking around for a seas2 plot thread that went nowhere, about Leland saying he knew Bob as a neighbor at his grampa's house where he used to stay in the summer. I had always assumed that meant the neighbor was the previous host of Bob. But then the name of the neighbor was Robertson.
Why the hell did Lynch abandoned this plot thread? It is so important and it's creepy good!
P.S. Oh the FBI in the show is a wacky bunch, they say Twin Peaks inhabitants are nuts, FBI is nuttier! Screaming Cole, trans Denise, acerbic Albert, now Tammy's butt shake, Diane, Cooper.
About Richard and Linda i mean maybe Giant was not tellling about Richard Horne, but about other Richard and Linda(boy and girl from 1956). Maybe Giant wanted Coop to know about the past. If Robertson is, or was just a host, then why BOB would put the letters under the nails of his vctims? T - for Teresa, R - for Laura, B - for Ronette, and O for Maddy? R,O,B,T - Robertson, or shortly BOB. Leland was also just a host, why not put the letters from his name? Thats why i think, or thought that BOB was a real human.
FBI agents are strange and charming in many ways. But i do want to know about Phillip Jefrries(Dawid Bowie was great at this role), and i'm interesting why this character is still alive? Why not Chester Desmond? He also dissapeared under the strange circumstances. Who is Judy?))) Why the monkey says her name after Lauras death?
In an old interview Frost admitted Judy was supposed to be Josie's sister....
But...he also admitted that Judy was fundamental to the plot and the story should the series have continued further...which it didn't. We know Jeffries met Judy in Argentina because in the 'missing pieces' he comes back to Gordon and tells him "I DONT WANT TO TALK ABOUT JUDY!"
Also, I have a strong feeling that Jeffries had/has found the way to travel in time...he appears in Argentina and seems to be....'burnt'? Definitely hurting and confused and then again appears at the FBI quarters... If he learnt to travel in time and meet Judy he is definitely MORE IMPORTANT than Chester! I believe Lynch wanted Bowie to be that important in the series because they shared so many beliefs and points of view and to make him central to the plot is a way to celebrate him.
I firmly believe Richard is the son of Bad Coop and Audrey (visiting her when she was in a coma...) therefore I think the Giant was talking about that Richard.
I also believe Good Cooper's objective (whenever he will wake up) is to stop something from happening....something bad....
Given the information about creation of Laura as BOB's visavis and the whole history of her being molested by BOB, i can now see the refference to LORE - Jesus vs Lucifer. Both resisted to temptation(according to biblical mythology). It was quite interesting to receive some answers but there are also many questions. For example:
What is BOB in fact? Was he a human(Robertson - son of Robert), or a spirit from the very beginning?
Boy and Girl - Leland and Sarah(to far from being true, as Leland originated from TP, and those ones were Latin american), or Richard and Linda?
Maybe if we connect the two questions we'll receive an answer. BOB was sent to Earth, but as fetus(or something simmilar) with lumberkacks to guide him, and he needed to be born by human woman?
As of Laura i'm not sure as she was born in 1971, while we can see her fetus(or smth) in 1956.
Lumberjack killer - Jurgen Prochnov in FWWM?
Mother- Experiment - Big Bad? Threating to balance in Universe? If so, then she is even more dangerous than BOB himself, as she was his creator.
And also, P.S. isn't it strange that in the series we can actually see that FBI agents are aware of spirits existence? Blue Rose. Maybe they know smth. about this Experiment? Hint - picture in Cole's office.
I'm gonna stop writting as my head is going blow. It will be interesting to watch further episodes. I guess the truth is out there=))
Agreed girl not Sarah. Agreed the boy looks Latin American. Thanks for telling the fact where Leland originated from. I don't think it's Richard. He was born after Coop came out of the Lodge. What makes you say Richard and Linda?
Hmm, interesting. Laura orb certainly was born by human woman, but she became a human. Bob, we never knew really lived as a human. Could he be the spirit of a person who was once alive? In another thread I was asking around for a seas2 plot thread that went nowhere, about Leland saying he knew Bob as a neighbor at his grampa's house where he used to stay in the summer. I had always assumed that meant the neighbor was the previous host of Bob. But then the name of the neighbor was Robertson.
Why the hell did Lynch abandoned this plot thread? It is so important and it's creepy good!
P.S. Oh the FBI in the show is a wacky bunch, they say Twin Peaks inhabitants are nuts, FBI is nuttier! Screaming Cole, trans Denise, acerbic Albert, now Tammy's butt shake, Diane, Cooper.
About Richard and Linda i mean maybe Giant was not tellling about Richard Horne, but about other Richard and Linda(boy and girl from 1956). Maybe Giant wanted Coop to know about the past. If Robertson is, or was just a host, then why BOB would put the letters under the nails of his vctims? T - for Teresa, R - for Laura, B - for Ronette, and O for Maddy? R,O,B,T - Robertson, or shortly BOB. Leland was also just a host, why not put the letters from his name? Thats why i think, or thought that BOB was a real human.
FBI agents are strange and charming in many ways. But i do want to know about Phillip Jefrries(Dawid Bowie was great at this role), and i'm interesting why this character is still alive? Why not Chester Desmond? He also dissapeared under the strange circumstances. Who is Judy?))) Why the monkey says her name after Lauras death?
Hmm, I dunno about Richard and Linda. There were the 2 Bobs and Mikes before, but the Linda in a wheelchair sounded to me like a character that will be important, just by the way she was introduced by a nonchalant mention like that. It was like a clue being dropped. Mike and Bobby were just brats, Richard Horne arguably could be just a brat, but this Linda though.
Yeah, I was puzzled by the fingernail letters - it sounded like the murderer was being inconsistent or got lazy : his name wasn't Robt! I always thought Lynch changed his mind and decided to abandon the letters, still missing E and R. The same way I thought he changed his mind with investigating the Robertson neighbor. And now I think he's changed his mind and made Laura the champion against Bob, and made Bob's possessions to be physical where an organic sac enters the host's body. Do you think that's possible, for Lynch?
In an old interview Frost admitted Judy was supposed to be Josie's sister....
But...he also admitted that Judy was fundamental to the plot and the story should the series have continued further...which it didn't. We know Jeffries met Judy in Argentina because in the 'missing pieces' he comes back to Gordon and tells him "I DONT WANT TO TALK ABOUT JUDY!"
Also, I have a strong feeling that Jeffries had/has found the way to travel in time...he appears in Argentina and seems to be....'burnt'? Definitely hurting and confused and then again appears at the FBI quarters... If he learnt to travel in time and meet Judy he is definitely MORE IMPORTANT than Chester! I believe Lynch wanted Bowie to be that important in the series because they shared so many beliefs and points of view and to make him central to the plot is a way to celebrate him.
I firmly believe Richard is the son of Bad Coop and Audrey (visiting her when she was in a coma...) therefore I think the Giant was talking about that Richard.
I also believe Good Cooper's objective (whenever he will wake up) is to stop something from happening....something bad....
Hi Moonchild. ?
I wrote you 2 questions in the Nature of Evil thread, maybe you didn't see. The 1st asking what you meant by Laura will be saved, the 2nd what you thought of the linked Oppenheimer article.
Please reply to them? I'm curious to hear what you think on both.
" The same way I thought he changed his mind with investigating the Robertson neighbor. And now I think he's changed his mind and made Laura the champion against Bob, and made Bob's possessions to be physical where an organic sac enters the host's body. Do you think that's possible, for Lynch?"
I think that was either confusion of Leland's memory, or Bob intentionally sending them off-track. Hawk investigated & told Harry it came up a dead-end.
I don't think the new show is completely changing ideas in the story, just something different initially happening with that girl in the 50's. Whether or not that creature was Bob we don't yet know.
" The same way I thought he changed his mind with investigating the Robertson neighbor. And now I think he's changed his mind and made Laura the champion against Bob, and made Bob's possessions to be physical where an organic sac enters the host's body. Do you think that's possible, for Lynch?"
I think that was either confusion of Leland's memory, or Bob intentionally sending them off-track. Hawk investigated & told Harry it came up a dead-end.
I don't think the new show is completely changing ideas in the story, just something different initially happening with that girl in the 50's. Whether or not that creature was Bob we don't yet know.
No, I meant the slimy sac that the hobos dug out of DoppelDale, Karen. Since when did Bob possess a person using an organic object like that?
I really don't think the bugfrog is Bob, because during Experiment's spawning, it was clear that all of them were eggs except 1 significantly larger sphere with a face image on it. And now that sac has the same face image. The eggs hatch into frogbugs, but Bob was special, Bob was never an egg.
Here's also why Bob was special : the Giant watched the explosion, he watched the hobos at the convenience store, he watched on till Experiment spawned, he watched the eggs, then only when he saw Bob did he freeze-frame the screen and floated up to create Laura.
I was thinking after I watched this that Bob had something to do with creating the eggs inside Experiment. Bob and the eggs then have the ability to travel through time and space after being vomited but can't travel far from the nuclear bomb test that I guess is supposed to be a catalyst or dimensional schism or astral earthquake. The orbs of both Bob and Laura I am thinking are religious Icons and the white and black lodges give them power. I don't know if it's allowed to bring up other sources that Lynch - Frost could be drawing from but my favorite movie growing up in the eighties was My Science Project. An alien orb in that movie gives a high school teenager the ability to travel through space and time after it is fed electricity. His science teacher Bob Roberts (played by Dennis Hopper who I think was also filming Blue Velvet at the time) accepts the orb as his science project and then uses it to travel through space and time and among other things, ensure the future good fortune of said boy and visit Woodstock. Then a few years later Dennis Hopper's friend Andy Warhol uses the name Bob Roberts to check in to a hospital knowing he will most likely die there. I understand Lynch and Frost have created their own Mythological narrative which I haven't read or studied yet. I am just thinking Bob might be the Lynch - Frost idea of the American nightmare which they keep changing ... or something. I think I heard a Catholic Priest once describe purgatory like the realization that time and space are and always were relative. I say that because the mushroom cloud is the same symbol of Einstein's theories of relativity as it is an image of the horrific destruction of war.
Fire walk with