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(@pred80r)
Dweller

 Ever experienced an alternate universe or different timeline?

This stuff is eating me alive...still.

Jack

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Posted : 07/12/2017 5:00 pm
(@caemeron)
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In dreams...

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Posted : 07/12/2017 7:46 pm
(@dobbshead)
RR Diner Patron

Well...

I have been witness to two different bad LSD trips.  On each occasion the person who straight lost they shit later described, um, well let me explain:

So he said that he got caught up in this revolving series of images/feeling which could best be described as being pulled down under the surface of water to different depths and coldnessess.  So, for example, he would see the band Pink Floyd, and then he would experience an embarrassing haircut, then his mother would be berating him, then he would be trapped on a knife throwers human wheel thing, then he would see spot lights pick him out of a crowd, and repeat, repeat, repeat.  At the end of the trip he said the merry-go-round of images started slowing down, like the final wheel spin on Price Is Right, and it finally landed on the spotlight scene which solidified and became the flashlights of the cops I had called to find which ditch he had thrown himself into on that dark country road.  (My own vision was, to say, unreliable, so I couldn't find him on my own.) 

Point being - he had seen the lights every cycle, but in the end the lights were the singular event of the cops locating him.  How did he see them during the previous 2-3 hours of bad trip? 

The other guy's bad trip also had some really strange out-of-order time breaks.  I don't remember the specifics just now.  It struck me how they both had that particular element though.    

Edited: 1 week  ago
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Posted : 07/12/2017 8:44 pm Brandy Fisher liked
(@pred80r)
Dweller

YES!!!!  TPTR is like a bad LSD trip...

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Posted : 07/12/2017 10:09 pm Joseph McMurty and Brandy Fisher liked
(@b-randy)
Detective Moderator
Posted by: Jack Dean

YES!!!!  TPTR is like a bad LSD trip...

I dunno.  I think it could be like a good LSD trip.

 

Don't know if I've ever experienced a different timeline or alternate universe.  Would I be conscious of it? Or would I forget that timeline too?

There is that James Hurley song.....that was an alternate universe.

 

Makes me think of Stranger Things (been watching that the last few days).  I like their theory of a different dimension........

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Posted : 08/12/2017 4:07 pm Joseph McMurty liked
(@dobbshead)
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I second the 'good' trip.  A beautiful confusion.  A dash of angry Polack not withstanding.

That scene made me sad.  Was that supposed to be an illustration of ' the best way to stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun'?   All I felt was senseless ugliness.  Not that Chantal and Hutch should be free to continue.  Confusing.   And wrong thread - sorry.

I have wondered if we jump timelines all the time and never have any possible sense of it.  As if it matters.  Many Worlds Interpretation might even require that.  Why would one timeline be more special or be the base reference for the others?  

Edited: 1 week  ago
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Posted : 08/12/2017 9:47 pm Brandy Fisher liked
(@caemeron)
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This seems like the place to put this, picking up on my previous comment. An idea that I have played with a lot is that dreams may give us glimpses/experiences of our alternate selves in parallel realities. Not that I endorse the view (I am sure some does, but I cannot recall a source to attribute), but it is something interesting to think about. Something I have thought about in separation from Twin Peaks.

But, then, I found myself applying this thought as I interpreted the finale. It was fairly central to the first epilogue Drink Full and Descend podcast we did... Which I mention both as a shameless plug, but also because I cannot believe I didn't get a certain thought in there, related to my personal experience. I didn't even really make the connection until the middle of the night last night, when I awoke from some strange dreams..

On the podcast I mentioned having dreams in which someone who has died was not dead, which I understand to be a fairly common experience. What I didn't think about or mention was the frequency with which, when I have had such dreams, the structure has precisely been that I thought they were dead and am discovering that they weren't. As in, they did not die in this dream experience, but disappeared. And I got to thinking about how directly that parallels what we were given by Lynch and Frost with regard to Laura.

It's another instance where I want to contend that something that seems very weird in Lynch is actually very true to life. And, of the way that Twin Peaks gives food for thought to such an extent that the thinking never stops, and "epiphanies" are possible indefinitely into the future.

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Posted : 14/12/2017 8:31 pm Jocelyn Rowe, Joseph McMurty and Brandy Fisher liked
(@pred80r)
Dweller
Posted by: Cæmeron Crain

This seems like the place to put this, picking up on my previous comment. An idea that I have played with a lot is that dreams may give us glimpses/experiences of our alternate selves in parallel realities. Not that I endorse the view (I am sure some does, but I cannot recall a source to attribute), but it is something interesting to think about. Something I have thought about in separation from Twin Peaks.

But, then, I found myself applying this thought as I interpreted the finale. It was fairly central to the first epilogue Drink Full and Descend podcast we did... Which I mention both as a shameless plug, but also because I cannot believe I didn't get a certain thought in there, related to my personal experience. I didn't even really make the connection until the middle of the night last night, when I awoke from some strange dreams..

On the podcast I mentioned having dreams in which someone who has died was not dead, which I understand to be a fairly common experience. What I didn't think about or mention was the frequency with which, when I have had such dreams, the structure has precisely been that I thought they were dead and am discovering that they weren't. As in, they did not die in this dream experience, but disappeared. And I got to thinking about how directly that parallels what we were given by Lynch and Frost with regard to Laura.

It's another instance where I want to contend that something that seems very weird in Lynch is actually very true to life. And, of the way that Twin Peaks gives food for thought to such an extent that the thinking never stops, and "epiphanies" are possible indefinitely into the future.

I guess my problem with dream sequences, especially in TPTR is that it would have to be several people having portions of the same dream because no one is aware of every scene.  And while this is a possibility, especially with Lynch/Frost I find it to be thin story telling...I think I called it parlor tricks somewhere earlier.  I just feel like it had to be something else, or I am just too let down with their work. It would be a lot like who shot JR if it was all just a dream sequence, only more convoluted and open ended.

But what the hell do I know, I am not a professional screenwriter and I have never written a script even.

Jack

 

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Posted : 15/12/2017 12:48 am
(@caemeron)
RR Diner Patron
Posted by: Jack Dean
Posted by: Cæmeron Crain

This seems like the place to put this, picking up on my previous comment. An idea that I have played with a lot is that dreams may give us glimpses/experiences of our alternate selves in parallel realities. Not that I endorse the view (I am sure some does, but I cannot recall a source to attribute), but it is something interesting to think about. Something I have thought about in separation from Twin Peaks.

But, then, I found myself applying this thought as I interpreted the finale. It was fairly central to the first epilogue Drink Full and Descend podcast we did... Which I mention both as a shameless plug, but also because I cannot believe I didn't get a certain thought in there, related to my personal experience. I didn't even really make the connection until the middle of the night last night, when I awoke from some strange dreams..

On the podcast I mentioned having dreams in which someone who has died was not dead, which I understand to be a fairly common experience. What I didn't think about or mention was the frequency with which, when I have had such dreams, the structure has precisely been that I thought they were dead and am discovering that they weren't. As in, they did not die in this dream experience, but disappeared. And I got to thinking about how directly that parallels what we were given by Lynch and Frost with regard to Laura.

It's another instance where I want to contend that something that seems very weird in Lynch is actually very true to life. And, of the way that Twin Peaks gives food for thought to such an extent that the thinking never stops, and "epiphanies" are possible indefinitely into the future.

I guess my problem with dream sequences, especially in TPTR is that it would have to be several people having portions of the same dream because no one is aware of every scene.  And while this is a possibility, especially with Lynch/Frost I find it to be thin story telling...I think I called it parlor tricks somewhere earlier.  I just feel like it had to be something else, or I am just too let down with their work. It would be a lot like who shot JR if it was all just a dream sequence, only more convoluted and open ended.

But what the hell do I know, I am not a professional screenwriter and I have never written a script even.

Jack

 

I have equally always resisted the idea of it being a dream in the sense of being "inside someone's head." Rather - if dreams give access to other dimensions/realities, then our own would be a dream from the perspective of any other, such that it would be dreams all the way down. Then, the only answer to who is the dreamer would be something like God.

Or, put in a less metaphysically thick way, perhaps dreams are just as real as waking life, and not merely subjective. 

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Posted : 15/12/2017 10:01 am Joseph McMurty liked
(@pred80r)
Dweller
Posted by: Cæmeron Crain
Posted by: Jack Dean
Posted by: Cæmeron Crain

This seems like the place to put this, picking up on my previous comment. An idea that I have played with a lot is that dreams may give us glimpses/experiences of our alternate selves in parallel realities. Not that I endorse the view (I am sure some does, but I cannot recall a source to attribute), but it is something interesting to think about. Something I have thought about in separation from Twin Peaks.

But, then, I found myself applying this thought as I interpreted the finale. It was fairly central to the first epilogue Drink Full and Descend podcast we did... Which I mention both as a shameless plug, but also because I cannot believe I didn't get a certain thought in there, related to my personal experience. I didn't even really make the connection until the middle of the night last night, when I awoke from some strange dreams..

On the podcast I mentioned having dreams in which someone who has died was not dead, which I understand to be a fairly common experience. What I didn't think about or mention was the frequency with which, when I have had such dreams, the structure has precisely been that I thought they were dead and am discovering that they weren't. As in, they did not die in this dream experience, but disappeared. And I got to thinking about how directly that parallels what we were given by Lynch and Frost with regard to Laura.

It's another instance where I want to contend that something that seems very weird in Lynch is actually very true to life. And, of the way that Twin Peaks gives food for thought to such an extent that the thinking never stops, and "epiphanies" are possible indefinitely into the future.

I guess my problem with dream sequences, especially in TPTR is that it would have to be several people having portions of the same dream because no one is aware of every scene.  And while this is a possibility, especially with Lynch/Frost I find it to be thin story telling...I think I called it parlor tricks somewhere earlier.  I just feel like it had to be something else, or I am just too let down with their work. It would be a lot like who shot JR if it was all just a dream sequence, only more convoluted and open ended.

But what the hell do I know, I am not a professional screenwriter and I have never written a script even.

Jack

 

I have equally always resisted the idea of it being a dream in the sense of being "inside someone's head." Rather - if dreams give access to other dimensions/realities, then our own would be a dream from the perspective of any other, such that it would be dreams all the way down. Then, the only answer to who is the dreamer would be something like God.

Or, put in a less metaphysically thick way, perhaps dreams are just as real as waking life, and not merely subjective. 

Now there is an answer I can buy into, the dreamer is "God" or a higher power awaiting the outcome.  If you try to make it a character from the show it falls flat on several levels.

Go ahead, try to dream of people you don't know in places you don't know doing things you don't understand...good luck with that.

Thanx,

Jack

 

 

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Posted : 15/12/2017 1:56 pm Brandy Fisher liked
(@dobbshead)
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Posted by: Cæmeron Crain

 

I have equally always resisted the idea of it being a dream in the sense of being "inside someone's head." Rather - if dreams give access to other dimensions/realities, then our own would be a dream from the perspective of any other, such that it would be dreams all the way down. Then, the only answer to who is the dreamer would be something like God.

Or, put in a less metaphysically thick way, perhaps dreams are just as real as waking life, and not merely subjective. 

I'm all for this.  I've heard reality described as a group hallucination.  And to think of sight and color as particular light frequencies absorbed and others reflected, sound as the propagation of energy in waves of one particular spectrum, and even the sensation of touch as a magnetic repulsion of valence electrons.  As a species we still have no idea how movement actually happens.  Is it continuous, or discrete teleportations? If in every instantaneous moment you are in one exact location, when is there time to move?  And why is time?  Reality itself has nothing to do with our tidy little assemblies, and dreams have every right to be on par with waking life.  

The only truth is that spammers suck

Edited: 1 day  ago
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Posted : 16/12/2017 4:27 am Chris Flackett liked
(@chris_flackett)
Dweller
Posted by: Joseph McMurty

As a species we still have no idea how movement actually happens.  Is it continuous, or discrete teleportations? If in every instantaneous moment you are in one exact location, when is there time to move?  

Sorry to take the thread off on a tangent, but Joseph I'm fascinated by this. What is it about movement we're unsure about? I've honestly never considered the question before. Would you be able to elaborate on or explain this? Preferably in layman's terms for little old me 😂

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Posted : 16/12/2017 9:40 am
(@caemeron)
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Posted by: Chris Flackett
Posted by: Joseph McMurty

As a species we still have no idea how movement actually happens.  Is it continuous, or discrete teleportations? If in every instantaneous moment you are in one exact location, when is there time to move?  

Sorry to take the thread off on a tangent, but Joseph I'm fascinated by this. What is it about movement we're unsure about? I've honestly never considered the question before. Would you be able to elaborate on or explain this? Preferably in layman's terms for little old me 😂

Zeno's paradox? To move a distance, one would first have to move half of that distance, half of that half, etc., such that movement should be impossible...

My preference is to go with a theoretical framework like that of Henri Bergson, which makes movement primary, but that is not an explanation of movement so much as the idea that we don't need to explain movement from the position of static stillness, because there is no such thing.

Curious as to how Joseph would describe the issue, as well.

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Posted : 16/12/2017 12:36 pm Chris Flackett liked
(@samxtherapy)
Detective

Seriously?  No, not really.  In dreams, yes.  Sort of.  I'll explain...

My dreams belong in a (so I was told by a military psychiatrist (long story, he's a friend)) very interesting sub-category of recurring dreams.  Mine aren't recurring, they are episodes from a single continuity.  According to my pal, it's a rare but not entirely unheard of phenomenon.  Significant of nothing, btw, since dreams are nowt more than the brain defragging.  Well, there is a significance, but the dreams themselves aren't part of it; it's more a window into how my mind works.  I always believed I have a very literal imagination and this seems to be the truth.

If you're at all interested, all my dreams take place in a version of Sheffield, my birthplace and where I spent most of my life.  The odd ones that don't happen there somehow always manage to tie in somehow.  Differences from the real place are, some aspects are predominant, as you'd expect they are mainly things from when I was a small child.  So, there's a lot of old buildings, 1950s style industry and the sort of creaky, clanky, rusty stuff that Lynch likes.  Think "Eraserhead" but usually without the sense of dread and threat.  It's generally a nice place.  It's not all grim and grimy industrial, though; there's sunlight and green open spaces, too.  

Most of the time, I use the house I lived in as a kid as my base, even though it's derelict and there's something truly horrible (but unseen) next door.  A couple of streets away there are some new-ish apartment blocks (In RL, they were built around 1969) which are now occupied by zombies.  It happens that I'm on good terms with the zombies, and they have helped me out from time to time.

Just up the road from my old house, I can catch a ferry to Finland.  Yep, it doesn't make sense to me, either.  Finland has no significance in my life that I can think of.  I only discovered this when, for reasons beyond understanding, I caught the ferry and fell asleep, only to wake up in Finland.  It was bloody cold.

There are several other places in and around the city where you can get a shortcut to somewhere else, but as far as I can tell, they all are within the Sheffield area.

Magic tends to work, some of the time.  Provided I do everything right, like following a recipe, and concentrate, I can make stuff happen.  Trouble is, I often forget this when I'm in a crisis.  I did, however, once find the machine that is responsible for generating all the evil in the world.  Unfortunately, I woke up before I managed to shut it down and since then, it's moved elsewhere.  

Phone boxes are all the old British types with a A and B button for calls and coins.  Google will show you, if you don't know.  But... there are no boxes as such, the phones are mounted on wooden poles.

The road my old house is on has a kind of transport system, with seats on poles, sticking up from the middle of the road.

A key part of the dreams is, I'm part of a team who travel through times and realities, sometimes just observing and sometimes intervening to make things turn out a particular way.  I don't know if we make things better or worse but we're left to make our own decisions.  We have a safe house in Meersbrook, a district of Sheffield, which looks ordinary on the outside but has infinite rooms inside.  The decor is all 1930 - 1950 British, and there are a pair of caretakers who are very much like my paternal grandparents.

Most of the people I meet in the dreams are recurring characters but with one or two exceptions, they don't resemble or remind me of anyone I know in RL.

Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum

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Posted : 16/12/2017 10:40 pm Chris Flackett liked
(@samxtherapy)
Detective

Movement?

That's pretty easy, according to current understanding.  The universe "ticks".  Nothing actually moves in a smooth, linear fashion, as in the way a Rolex second finger appears, but rather, jumps from one state to the next, like a cheap Chinese knock off watch.

ISTR, the absolute limit of time measurement is a Planck Length and below that, there is nothing between one and the next.  Really nothing, in so much as the Universe itself can be considered as nonexistant, if you were to count a changing state as the definition of existance.  So, everything hops from one Planck unit to the next, like a very fine grained, high speed movie, where persistence of vision smooths things out into a continuous, linear experience.

Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum

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Posted : 16/12/2017 10:46 pm Chris Flackett liked
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